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International And Domestic Propaganda Winning

The authoritarian regimes are really good at both international and domestic propaganda. As I browsed social media, particularly facebook and in many groups with large number of followers, there are hundreds of bots and Internet brigades. Some really spent time creating profiles that seem genuine. Basically, the bots will just like those pro establishment response, making the statement look valid with enormous of likes. As most people don’t investigate and critical think, they may take the comment as logic. In the last one year, I had found thousand of such accounts, not just in Singapore but in Malaysia, they put their country location. As for the international propaganda, the locations are either US or Malaysia or Taiwan.

Watching local sitcoms, there are many scripts that also tried to brainwash locals. In one scene, Lee Guo Huang was acting like a die hard opposition, scolding his son that everything from govt is bad. Another scene, a local auntie was scolding a supermaket PRC worker that she could not speak English. There were many other local dramas that such brainwashing content are included for obvious reasons. It is not the first time but many similar scenes about such, they seem to have harboured political agenda to brainwash locals. How about locals being discriminated by foreign managers at work? How about locals arguing that GST did not help the poor? Why don’t they write these into the stories too? Isn’t it obvious that they are using MSM and everything to brainwash?

The international propaganda often comes from Malaysia, with Malaysian Chinese the key, showing Chinese videos which often illustrate US and West as villains. They also go to Taiwanese social media to do similar work. Also surprised many Singapore fake accounts also join these Malaysians in condemning US and West.

The winners are obvious. Many locals repeat the propaganda they read on MSM or dramas they watch. Today, 60% Singapore and Malaysian Chinese supports Xi and 40% supports Putin. So whether Russia invades any country, they are deemed to be correct. Or China can harass any South China Seas nations, they are seem to be doing the right thing. So whether International and Domestic propaganda using wumaos, IBs and MSM have succeeded.

 

Malcom Chan

 

 

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READER COMMENTS BELOW

80 Responses to “International And Domestic Propaganda Winning”

  • knn:

    The international propaganda often comes from Malaysia, with Malaysian Chinese the key, showing Chinese videos which often illustrate US and West as villains. They also go to Taiwanese social media to do similar work. Also surprised many Singapore fake accounts also join these Malaysians in condemning US and West. Malcom Chan

    So to you they are wrong, the US and the West are angels.

    Have you ever think or ask, how many wars the Americans and the West are fighting and how many innocents they have killed, how many Iraqis, Syrians and Afghans have they massacred? Also the Mulsims in Kosovo.

    Then asked, how many wars have China or Russia fought since WW2 and how many innocent people have they killed?

    How many bombs have the Americans dropped all over the world, and still dropping every minute?

    Heard of stupidity has no cure? Heard of the meaning of unthinking? Heard of ignoramus? Heard of idiots?

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  • myfirstscrew:

    Xi just announced that one country two systems is working and the anniversary is a truly a democracy. LOL

    I thought after he purged all the oppositions and locked up all the dissidents to ensure two country one system……

    Dictators seem to be emperor withOUT clothes.

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  • BULLSHITHAPPENS:

    @knn

    Have you ever think or ask, how many wars the Americans and the West are fighting and how many innocents they have killed, how many Iraqis, Syrians and Afghans have they massacred? Also the Mulsims in Kosovo.

    Answer: All these are in the middle east, for last 30 years, did any of these affected you?

    Problem 1: South China SEAS never have any kind of problems until China started building structures and insisted its 9 dot dashes which covers all the way from China to Johor. That itself is not a problem until Chinese frigates, warships and aircrafts are harassing ships and fishermen not to use to use the route and not fish there. Is this a US or West propaganda?

    Problem 2: China wants to own a security force in Pacific Ocean and build a naval base on Solomons Island. Normally New Zealand is neutral but now New Zealand is also alarmed. Is this a US or West propaganda?

    Problem 3: If HK is really a true democracy like what Xi has said, one country two systems; why all the rich, elites and middle class have migrated out and even the businesses also relocated, a lot in Singapore. Is this again a US or West propaganda?

    Heard of stupidity has no cure? Heard of the meaning of unthinking? Heard of ignoramus? Heard of idiots? LOL

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  • Very stupiack people:

    Will leeguohuang reads this?

    It could be used in his next script on how stupiack some people could be!

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  • ah seng:

    PAPPY using MSM to achieve brainwashing:

    1. Recently so many articles about locals becoming hawkers and food delivery

    2. Local Dramas also include locals bullying foreigners, truth is locals are the ones being discriminated by foreigners at jobs.

    3. Articles telling locals not to buy BTO but to rent.

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  • xoxo:

    Seems some *chiak kantang* types still love colonial masters.
    West is good,East is bad?
    Isnt it also A PROPAGANDA itself?
    There are many daft chiak kantangs still thinking americans uphold *In God ,we trust*.
    For a fact,american$ themselves DONT!
    WHO IS GOOD,WHO IS BAD.
    ONLY GOD KNOWS!

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  • My 2 Rmb cents:

    @knn

    Because of the USA policing the world, it has had made much of the world a safer place – isn’t the Chinese reaping peace dividends at the West expense, USA’s expense.

    The USA and Nato helped saved 100s of 1000s of Bosnian Muslims lives in the Balkan Wars. PRC watched gleefully presumably.

    Much of the free world has condemned Russia’s attack on Ukraine. PRC? Yes PRC acted – blamed Nato for projected expansion towards the East and threatening Russia. Of course PRC is not a sovereign democracy and don’t recognise free world countries choices of international relationship directions each chooses.

    The

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  • My 2 Rmb cents:

    Because of the USA policing the world, it has had made much of the world a safer place – isn’t the Chinese reaping peace dividends at the West expense, USA’s expense.

    The USA and Nato helped saved 100s of 1000s of Bosnian Muslims lives in the Balkan Wars. PRC watched gleefully presumably.

    Much of the free world has condemned Russia’s attack on Ukraine. PRC? Yes PRC acted – blamed Nato for projected expansion towards the East and threatening Russia. Of course PRC is not a sovereign democracy and don’t recognise free world countries choices of international relationship directions each chooses.

    The

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  • Harder Truths:

    We have these on TRE as well. They go around insulting and trying to create havoc. The suddenly disappear. Then come back under another name. Quite a few this year as well.

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    How to spot unthinking, stupid lackeys spreading disinformation – they only ALWAYS present ONE side of the coin without much in-depth analysis. (after all, that is the purpose of propaganda, right? – present only selective “facts”)

    Why has US been in so many wars since WW2? Because it is dominant superpower since 1945, has the muscles to intervene when its interests are affected, and generally keeps the world in some sort of balance. Whether that balance is to everyone liking is another matter.

    Russia not involved in many wars since WW2 even though it is a superpower (or a had-been superpower)? Please lah, Soviet Union/Russia doctrine is different. They preferred to use proxies for their “wars” – Soviet tanks and weapons are the MOST numerous in the world. Why they give military stuff so freely, such that opposing sides must seek arms from US/Westerns? Also, only times Russians tried to fight a “modern” war like in Afghanistan and now Ukraine – shows they really bad at it. So, better to use proxies, Mr Putin.

    China not involved in many wars since WW2? Korea war intervention 1950 – FAILED; Sino-Vietnamese war – got clobbered in several skirmishes by the Viets (if I recall correctly); ongoing India-China “war” in the southern boarders – kkn better not mention this, hor. Look, only in last 10-15 years has China started to arm itself sufficiently to project power. So China not involved in many wars since WW2 is not because it is benign or peaceful, but it simply has NO CAPABILITY before.

    So much more to analyse/share/discuss, but obviously if one can poke holes into arguments that Russia/China/whoever are not bullies or war-mongers in 5 minutes, then the arguments are already shxt-quality – again clear sign that many are just spreading propaganda for their masters. As per said by the author MC.

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  • PAP mandate strong:

    Well as the late 倪匡 said before,

    真可惜,天生奴性的人太多了,這樣的情形,維持了半個世紀,居然還可以維持下去,那些屈服在強權勢力前,醜態百出的人,真比蟑螂還叫人噁心!

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  • Trust only myself:

    Funny…… policing the world and yet US is the only country at war almost every year since WWII………how is it the world is a safer place because of them?

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    So whether Russia invades any country, they are deemed to be correct. Or China can harass any South China Seas nations, they are seem to be doing the right thing.
    ========================================================
    Dear Malcom Chan and all the Ang Mo Tua Kee,
    So Americunts/West are Angels? Luckily we got Indians who dare to speak out.

    Arnab Calls Out US Hypocrisy & War Crimes:
    __’They Form & Abandon Alliances As Per Convenience’
    video at https://shorturl.at/mHU24

    ‘Worst Perpertaors Of Atrocities’:
    __Arnab Reminds U.S Of Committing Multiple Human Rights Violations
    video at https://shorturl.at/tA159

    Arnab Takes On Americans Accusing Others Of Meddling In Nations’ internal Affairs
    video at https://shorturl.at/ablJK

    WEST HYPOCRISY ON INTERNATIONAL LAW
    video at https://shorturl.at/acnA1

    BULLSHITHAPPENS: Have you ever think or ask, how many wars the Americans and the West are fighting and how many innocents they have killed, how many Iraqis, Syrians and Afghans have they massacred? Also the Mulsims in Kosovo.

    Answer: All these are in the middle east, for last 30 years, did any of these affected you?

    It happen in the last 30 years and it is still happening now.
    @BULLSHITHAPPENS, on this point, you are the stopid one and you are the idiots.

    Syria is still in turmoils and Yes, it affect us. We does have Syrian refugees in SG albeit they are rich one. Have money will travel.

    BULLSHITHAPPENS:
    Problem 1: South China SEAS never have any kind of problems until China started building structures and insisted its 9 dot dashes which covers all the way from China to Johor. That itself is not a problem until Chinese frigates, warships and aircrafts are harassing ships and fishermen not to use to use the route and not fish there. Is this a US or West propaganda?

    Problem 2: China wants to own a security force in Pacific Ocean and build a naval base on Solomons Island. Normally New Zealand is neutral but now New Zealand is also alarmed. Is this a US or West propaganda?

    Problem 3: If HK is really a true democracy like what Xi has said, one country two systems; why all the rich, elites and middle class have migrated out and even the businesses also relocated, a lot in Singapore. Is this again a US or West propaganda?

    Heard of stupidity has no cure? Heard of the meaning of unthinking? Heard of ignoramus? Heard of idiots? LOL

    @KNN, just problem 1 alone make you the stopid and idiots.

    Conclusion: Malcom Chan, BULLSHITHAPPENS and you KNN are all stopid and big idiots. All three of you make good canon fodders.

    All 3 of you please be canon fodder for Ukraine at the frontline.
    Captured Americunt beg for mercy.
    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/i-didnt-fire-shot-says-american-held-by-separatists-eastern-ukraine-2022-06-29

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    Fight tyranny love freedom but beg for mercy when captured? Hahaha…

    Amercunt beg for mercy … I didn’t fire a shot …
    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/i-didnt-fire-shot-says-american-held-by-separatists-eastern-ukraine-2022-06-29/

    Any pro democracy freedom fighter here want to go Russia and rescue him?
    (Oppie supporters don’t be shy. You may contact CIA operated front shop National Endowment for Democracy to send you in.)

    If you are too stopid to believe in Western propaganda that Ukraine is winning the war, you deserve the consequences you are in.

    In Dollar$ We Tru$t

    Raytheon Technologies share price
    Mar 15 $95.8 before war
    Apr 12 $103.46

    Lockheed Martin Corp share price
    Mar 15 $421.34 before war
    Apr 12 $468.96

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Harder Truths:
    We have these on TRE as well. They go around insulting and trying to create havoc. The suddenly disappear. Then come back under another name. Quite a few this year as well.

    Agree on this point. Allowing one person to have multi-names is a very bad policy – but then each site owner/operator has its own choice on how to run a site. Perhaps this is one issue why TRE has not been able to attract hordes of followers, only lots of doggies trolling, flooding out any quality discussions from taking roots.

    Anyway best of luck to TRE!

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  • Spineless Sinkie Syndrome:

    International Politics (and ProPAPganda) is going to face a sea-change as more & more common folk realize their FAILURES.

    However, most Sinkies will just focus on themselves, or LOCAL domestic issues, such as rising cost of living or COE prices etc. LOL.
    SSS Sinkies can’t be bothered with what happens outside of our little red dot lah. LOL.

    If you engage Sinkies on some far away geo-political crisis such as the Russian-Ukraine war, most will just spew the standard MSM interpretation, or what they hear/read from our “world-class S**T Times”. Yes?/No? LOL.

    So, to keep things simple for Sinkies, I just tell them to buy Ivermectin as insurance policy for themselves, against current & future Covid variant(s).

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/crMcf8jsqZPh/

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  • panyusg:

    Spore is wrong. Russia did not invade a small country called Ukraine.

    For eight years, the Donbass region was brutalized by the Nazi like forces pushed by Kiev.

    Putin has been asking that Ukraine stop joining NATO. Joining EU is okay.

    But Zelensky was insistent..now NATO says, they will not admit Ukraine…but that is after the War started.

    Before the War, there were no independent repbulics in Donbass. Putin has no choice…if NATO enters Ukraine with its flat lands, it is a direct path to invade Russia sometime in the future.

    Ukraine is not a small country like Spore. So, for Spore to make a case is ridiculous. Look at the size of Ukraine. Look at peanut Singapore.

    If Putin likes to invade small countries, he could have invaded Estonia, Latvia or Moldova.

    The only reason for the War…Zelensky insisted on joining NATO.

    The future: Ukraine will be partitioned. Russia has not turned the War into a Cold War to destroy even EU. And also bring down the mighty USD.

    This War will be on in 2023.

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    Dear all Ang Mo Tua Kee and Malcom Chan,
    Is this democracy, freedom, human right ?

    Shot 90 Times By Akron Police – BodyCam Footage
    https://bit.ly/3yj68tc

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/07/01/jayland-walker-police-shooting-july-fourth-ohio/

    Autopsy records show that eight police officers fired more than 90 rounds at Walker, with more than 60 striking his body, DiCello told The Post.

    Dear Singaporeans, do you want this in Singapore ?

    You vote in Opposition, gangster will run amok…

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    panyusg:
    Spore is wrong. Russia did not invade a small country called Ukraine.

    For eight years, the Donbass region was brutalized by the Nazi like forces pushed by Kiev.

    Putin has been asking that Ukraine stop joining NATO. Joining EU is okay.

    But Zelensky was insistent..now NATO says, they will not admit Ukraine…but that is after the War started.

    Before the War, there were no independent repbulics in Donbass. Putin has no choice…if NATO enters Ukraine with its flat lands, it is a direct path to invade Russia sometime in the future.

    Ukraine is not a small country like Spore. So, for Spore to make a case is ridiculous. Look at the size of Ukraine. Look at peanut Singapore.

    If Putin likes to invade small countries, he could have invaded Estonia, Latvia or Moldova.

    The only reason for the War…Zelensky insisted on joining NATO.

    The future: Ukraine will be partitioned. Russia has not turned the War into a Cold War to destroy even EU. And also bring down the mighty USD.

    This War will be on in 2023.

    Well, except the first line, I agreed with all.

    Unfortunately 10 years series templated exam cheaters Oppies have no in depth analytical skill and they are either con by Americunt or Chinacunt.

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  • Partial truth?:

    Not the whole truth!

    Berkshire Hathaway was trading at $415,800 per share. Even Alphabet are trading at $2,170 per share.

    Lockheed Martin market cap only 116 billions.

    Apple market cap 2.6 trillions.

    I sincerely hope you reap good rewards since you expect the following aerospace stocks to spike up.

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  • bssssss:

    50% of SG/MY Chinese support Xi, 40% of SG/MY support Putin.

    It shows that most Chinese love dictatorship than democracy.

    The comments reflect many dictatorship lovers.

    This can explain why PAPPY continues to win under Pinky.

    Really cannot expect why people enjoy being intimidated and managed like puppies.

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  • Billy ma:

    There’re probably one & a half generations of Singaporeans who are brainwashed & still can be easily sway by the PAP.
    Yes, those aunties who were bussed to PAP’s rallies & happy with the packet of beehoon or snacks provided by PA for their attendance.
    Yes, these aunties are the one who will vote PAP no matter what.
    But the good news is that they’re what’s left.
    The young generation won’t be so easily brainwash.

    And Singaporeans are facing the harsh reality of life & realising what where & who are responsible for the problems they’re facing.

    That 1.5 generations of aunties will be around for at least 2 more cycles.
    10 years?
    The wheel will stop turning.

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  • knn:

    The level of stupidity here is so embarrassing. Talking and thinking like primary school kids.

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  • Western Sheep:

    He must be talking about those western unthinking sheep. Colony for long time but long for the master when they left. Those slaves (uplifted to “pro-democracy”) are languishing in the master land.

    PAP mandate strong:
    Well as the late 倪匡 said before,

    真可惜,天生奴性的人太多了,這樣的情形,維持了半個世紀,居然還可以維持下去,那些屈服在強權勢力前,醜態百出的人,真比蟑螂還叫人噁心!

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Pappies allow their 160-ranked media in the world to be kept alive using 900m of taxpayers. Even overseas observers can see how stupid and insecure are our highest paid pap-leaders, using propaganda apparatus without shame. Oh, but didn’t someone earned the “Dishonorable Son” title hands-down?

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Recall previously a doggies-troll even said that the Russians and Chinese were on the verge of being first to land on the moon. So USA staged their moon landing and broadcasted in to the world. Talk about absolute stupidity and nonsense, when trolls are desperate. But obviously they never feel embarrassed. Next they will say Cotton is from Sheep without blinking an eye. (Or that already happened???)

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  • Pinky Inc. & Pfizer got you...:

    The Global CONglomerates even conned the European Parliament!

    https://fb.watch/e3uWuwLjbI/

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  • BIG READ: Stop the PAP Steal:

    knn:
    The level of stupidity here is so embarrassing. Talking and thinking like primary school kids.

    Shocking. But not surprise. Your presence here makes no sense except what u just wrote applied to your self and you try to deflect. Haha

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  • knn:

    Julian called it ‘The Empire of Lies’.

    The silly and unthinking here just would not want to face this hard truth. They enjoy being lied to like kindergarten children, and thinking the lies were truths and very proud of themselves.

    The Americans landed on the moon in the 60s. Wow wee. But now could not make their own rocket to the International Space Station. And they claimed they had been to the moon 7 times. It must be so easy. Now with all the advances made in technology, they are unable to go back to the moon. It would be so simple, just bring out the blueprints and reproduce the same rockets that made it to the moon so many times.

    Oops, lost all the blueprints. Cannot reprint, can only reprint fiat money. Now in great fear. What if the Chinese or Russians really got to the moon and found out the Americans were lying all the while. No American footprints, no American flags, no American lies.

    Horror, horror, where to hide the face? This is more shameful than WMD lies. Moon landing becomes American fairy tales.

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  • xoxo:

    No one criticises WESTERN PROPAGANDA as if only Asian countries are the only ones doing so?
    I say the UKRAINIAN WAR has been USED by the WEST as a propaganda as well!
    Can any honest n unprejudiced guy say not?
    WHY ,instead of trying to sow peace,the WEST is openly using Ukraine as a *battle-ground* ,a *playing field*?

    I think supplying weaponry n cheer-leading are not the WAY TO PEACE.
    DO CRITICS OF EAST THINK SO?

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  • idontbelieveinccpbs:

    Many people here seems to twist the logic, those who support autocracy likely to be so. Xi said that now HK is more democractic after he purged all the oppositions and activists. Honestly, this is laughable.

    Xi together with Putin are to promote their democracy brand to the world. Is this an irony?

    Democracy can be now defined using autocracy model. This is why my China friends keep arguing, 是民主。。。。 i kept pressing and then they said, “为民做主”。 So the China definition of Democracy is to decide on behalf of people, it is like what PAPPY tell Singaporeans, leave and trust all decisions to us. Isn’t it?

    How many of us willing to let other people decide for you that you dont have any form of participation? So all these clowns here supporting China or Russia needs to know that if you are in this model, you probably cannot be providing your feedback here in TRE, everything is decided by the party.

    Now China go to the extreme extent and bans casual words like “money钱”, people cannot type 钱 on social media, you have to use rice instead aka “我今天赚了多少米”. Money钱 is now a dirty word on China Social Media. This is your China model and if you love it, migrate there.

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  • PAP mandate strong:

    @ Western Sheep

    Haha! You guess wrongly. He dislike or actually hate CCP. Well this proved Eastern Eunuch dont do homework. At least read up his life stories in wiki.

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  • MarBowling:

    Pinky Inc. & Pfizer got you…:
    July 5, 2022 at 12:49 pm (Quote)
    The Global CONglomerates even conned the European Parliament!

    https://fb.watch/e3uWuwLjbI/

    Response: GREAT INFO! The Husband(Mai Hum)and Wifey(Holee Jinx)Tag Team should IMMEDIATELY SHOW ALL THE CITIZEN THE HOLEE SECRET AGREEMENT THEY HAD SIGNED WITH THOSE BIG PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES LIKE PFIZER AND MODERNA THAT $BILLIONS OF TAXPAYERS HARD EARNED MONEY HAVE BEEN USED BY THE TAG TEAM TO ACQUIRE THOSE HOLEE MRNA VACCINES! Since more than 90% of the population have already Kenna VACCINATED by those Holee mRNA Pfizer and MODERNA vaccines, isn’t the RIGHT and APPROPRIATE TIME to show us that HOLEE SECRET AGREEMENT NOW! Hopefully, the WP or PSP will bring up this IMPORTANT TOPIC/ISSUE in the next ParLeeMent session!

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  • Singaporean R Free Rider:

    Bad Boy:
    https://3g.163.com/dy/article/HBE89PKA0553E3JY.html?referFrom=&spss=adap_dy

    唐山再出命案,

    Oh my goodness, Chinacunt is just like the Americunt, lawless cuntry …

    While Chinacunt criminal murder, Americunt Police murder too.

    Shot 90 Times By Akron Police – BodyCam Footage
    https://bit.ly/3yj68tc

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/07/01/jayland-walker-police-shooting-july-fourth-ohio/

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    There is really no cure for stupidity. If the Russian/Chinese still thinks the US moon landings in the 1960s were FAKE and there is actually no evidence left on the moon surface for those, then China’s recent mission to the dark side of the moon must also be FAKE. With the technology to reach the far side of the moon, they cannot fly over the near side to confirm no landings were done in 1960s by USA, hor? Born stupid, cannot be help; born stupid and KNN, got no hope.

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    xoxo:
    No one criticises WESTERN PROPAGANDA as if only Asian countries are the only ones doing so?
    I say the UKRAINIAN WAR has been USED by the WEST as a propaganda as well!
    Can any honest n unprejudiced guy say not?
    WHY ,instead of trying to sow peace,the WEST is openly using Ukraine as a *battle-ground* ,a *playing field*?

    I think supplying weaponry n cheer-leading are not the WAY TO PEACE.
    DO CRITICS OF EAST THINK SO?

    Once a war is started, both sides will use propaganda to some degree or other. So the main question firstly is: Who started this current war?

    Then the secondary questions are like:
    1) Do you think Russia’s “special operation” is justified?
    2) Do you think “denazification” means indiscriminate killing and targeting of civilians? Does “liberating” the Eastern cities/towns from “cheering” Russian-speaking Ukrainians justify levelling their homes? Are they even cheering?
    3) When Russia annexed Crimea 2014, is that your way to sow peace?
    4) Do you think countries (both ex-Eastern blocs and neutrals) joining NATO is because of coercion from the West or because of threat from the East?
    5) Are you even familiar with military matters? You might as well ask if Putin is openly using Ukraine as a “”battleground” or “Playing field” to test if his feared 12,000 tanks can stand up to Western anti-tank weapons. I heard the Russian Kontakt-5 ERA is pretty good. So good that they are betting it will save their ancient T-62s.

    So do put something on the table for discussion instead of simply crying wolf.

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  • xoxo:

    Propaganda only after war started?
    So,THE WEST HAD NEVER STARTED A WAR BEFORE?
    So,China has,started a war?
    Crying wolf?
    I try not to be a hypocrite.
    Cheerio.

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  • Singaporean R Free Rider:

    theforgottongeneration: Once a war is started, both sides will use propaganda to some degree or other. So the main question firstly is: Who started this current war?

    Then the secondary questions are like:
    1) Do you think Russia’s “special operation” is justified?
    2) Do you think “denazification” means indiscriminate killing and targeting of civilians? Does “liberating” the Eastern cities/towns from “cheering” Russian-speaking Ukrainians justify levelling their homes? Are they even cheering?
    3) When Russia annexed Crimea 2014, is that your way to sow peace?
    4) Do you think countries (both ex-Eastern blocs and neutrals) joining NATO is because of coercion from the West or because of threat from the East?
    5) Are you even familiar with military matters? You might as well ask if Putin is openly using Ukraine as a “”battleground” or “Playing field” to test if his feared 12,000 tanks can stand up to Western anti-tank weapons. I heard the Russian Kontakt-5 ERA is pretty good. So good that they are betting it will save their ancient T-62s.

    So do put something on the table for discussion instead of simply crying wolf.

    XOXO show more wisdom than you..

    Only people like you who do not have in depth critical thinking will ask such questions.

    Please watch professional analysis before you even open your mouth.
    US betrayed Ukraine. ’22.07.04【觀點│亮點交鋒】烏克蘭被出賣對台灣啟示
    https://bit.ly/3nFIjqC

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  • knn:

    Why no one bothers to ask about the genocides, occupation and destruction in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, etc etc.?

    Is it because the dead were not blonds and blue eyes, but Muslims and Arabs? So no need to bother, no need to cry crocodile tears?

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  • Tongkatalisulaiman:

    We thought PRC and ROC are just “Cunts” to you?

    Why bother to cite what Cunts have to say?

    Singaporean R Free Rider: XOXO show more wisdom than you..

    Only people like you who do not have in depth critical thinking will ask such questions.

    Please watch professional analysis before you even open your mouth.
    US betrayed Ukraine. ’22.07.04【觀點│亮點交鋒】烏克蘭被出賣對台灣啟示
    https://bit.ly/3nFIjqC

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  • k:

    Tongkatalisulaiman:
    We thought PRC and ROC are just “Cunts” to you?

    Why bother to cite what Cunts have to say?

    Pathetic remnants of American and western genocides and wars and still siding and idolising the whites.

    When is your turn to become collateral damages?

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Tongkatalisulaiman:
    We thought PRC and ROC are just “Cunts” to you?

    Why bother to cite what Cunts have to say?

    LOL, yeah more Ownself Appraise Ownself. Double confirm – stupidity is ingrained in the doggies and trolls.

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Pappies and their doggies in-depth critical thinking: Give their pig very long runway (and million$ pay) and the pig will eventually fly. Must pray-pray, hor.

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  • Singaporean R Free Rider:

    Tongkatalisulaiman:
    We thought PRC and ROC are just “Cunts” to you?

    Why bother to cite what Cunts have to say?

    Like your Communist Cheat Party leader Deng said, Black cat or white cat, as long as it catches rats, it is good cat…Yes ? No ?

    And turn it the other way, Singaporeans or Foreigner workers, as long as it can help Singapore punch above its weigh, it is good workers ? No ?

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  • PAP mandate strong:

    @ I think supplying weaponry n cheer-leading are not the WAY TO PEACE.
    DO CRITICS OF EAST THINK SO?

    Depend on individual perspectives.
    During 2nd world war, without 租借法 to supply weapons to Europe you know what will happen. By the way even Hitler is against communism.

    Not only supply to Europe but also to Russia if not Russia also game over.

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    xoxo: I say the UKRAINIAN WAR has been USED by the WEST as a propaganda as well!

    Well said..

    history of betrayal

    1) Form & Abandon Alliances As Per Convenience
    video at https://shorturl.at/mHU24

    2) US betrayed Ukraine. ’22.07.04【觀點│亮點交鋒】烏克蘭被出賣對台灣啟示
    video at https://bit.ly/3nFIjqC

    history of betrayal …it is just beginning…more coming

    1) Sri Lankan Crisis between Chinese Debt-trap and Strategic-trap
    https://isdp.eu/sri-lankan-crisis-between-debt-trap-and-strategic-trap-the-chinese-stake/

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    xoxo: I say the UKRAINIAN WAR has been USED by the WEST as a propaganda as well!

    Well said..

    Americunt history of betrayal

    1) Form & Abandon Alliances As Per Convenience
    video at https://shorturl.at/mHU24

    2) US betrayed Ukraine. ’22.07.04【觀點│亮點交鋒】烏克蘭被出賣對台灣啟示
    video at https://bit.ly/3nFIjqC

    Chinacunt history of betrayal …it is just beginning…more coming

    1) Sri Lankan Crisis between Chinese Debt-trap and Strategic-trap
    https://isdp.eu/sri-lankan-crisis-between-debt-trap-and-strategic-trap-the-chinese-stake/

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  • Western Sheep:

    Simple people can’t understand sarcasm.

    PAP mandate strong:
    @ Western Sheep

    Haha! You guess wrongly. He dislike or actually hate CCP. Well this proved Eastern Eunuch dont do homework. At least read up his life stories in wiki.

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  • idontbelieveinccpbs:

    @Singaporeans are free riders using a lot of propaganda

    Basically 2 groups of writers here:

    1. Pro autocracy China/Russia and PAPPY
    2. Pro Democracy

    Group 1 always use propaganda and blind faith, without much logic or warped logic, they cannot accept logic.

    Group 2 always try to reason and show facts.

    So why dont group 1 move to China, at least prove to Group 2 that they really mean what they say?

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  • MarBowling:

    Understand UK is now in Political Crisis when many IMPOTENT Oops IMPORTANT Ministers have RESIGNED en masse!. THINK it’s due to a number of Political and Vested Interest reasons!

    One Holee reason being, while the ordinary British folks were subject to Draconian and Restrictive measures due to Covid19, their Girl oops Naughty Boy with the Golden Hair was Partying and Screwing around behind closed door with his bunch of merry men! Recently, instead of using those taxpayers hard earned £billions money to HELP his struggling and suffering ordinary folks amidst covid19, this EGOTISTIC Golden Hair Joker with the BLESSINGS of his BESTEST Buddy, Sleepy Joe, has chosen to DISPATCH those £billions worth of arms and what not to Pre£ident Monica Zelenskyy to HELP Ukraine TO FIGHT AND WIN THE HOLEE WAR AGAINST Russia! Some Patriotic Ministers are up in arms against this FATTY BOOM BOOM!

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  • BK:

    The framing of the Ukraine-Russia war is incomplete without the background of the breakup of the Soviet Union.

    Russia also had a war with Georgia in 2008, on the same premise of protecting Russian speaking populations. Then they took Crimea.

    And if you are a small country in Europe near Russia, what will be the legitimate course of action? Of course you try to join Nato.

    Turkiye (formally Turkey) a Nato member, never condemned Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, it initially objected to Sweden and Finland joining Nato, then did a deal and lifted the objection.

    The countries liked Turkiye and India that remain neutral do so for their own interest, not because they support Russia.

    Russia’s problems are a result of its colonialism, much as Britain had done. Soviet Union rule had a bad after taste, and countries liked Poland, Georgia, Ukraine etc do not trust them.

    Now, while it is true that Nato may encroach Russia strategic space, what is Russia doing to downplay its historical role of suppression and alleviate the fears of its neighborhood?

    Is invading Ukraine going to change anything except to hike up the fears of its neighbors? Which in the end means the neighbors will seek bigger brothers to counter Russia…and Russia feels even more threatened…another Russia invasion later?

    Is a vicious cycle. The so called Nazis of Ukraine are there forever, so why invade now?

    Liked China, Russia has its own clans of power points; oligarchs, military complex and the bureaucrats, very likely there is an internal struggle, and Putin needs an external outlet.

    China supports Russia:

    1. It cannot afford to see Russia collapsed.
    2. Russia is not the strategic competitor, it is useful as a buffer against US.

    However, Russia does little to add to its tech or economic growth.

    Why China needs war to end:

    1. It took a reputational hit. Thats why it went to Oceania and Central and South Asia.
    2. More of Europe will fall into US umbrella as a defense mechanism against Russia.
    3. It will affect its Belt and Road.
    4. The USD and USD interest rates will go up, affecting developing nations bonds. This in turn will affect China investments.
    5.Global growth will stagnate or go into recession. Xi wont want a bad economic report come end of year as he goes into 3rd term.

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  • Bananas are better than LJ:

    Totally laughable that some are convinced that the Apollo moon landings in 1960s are fake. Result of a country’s LJ “national education”? More believable that the covid virus was made in a Wuhan lab gone rogue.

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  • Real democracy:

    idontbelieveinccpbs:
    @Singaporeans are free riders using a lot of propaganda

    Basically 2 groups of writers here:

    1. Pro autocracy China/Russia and PAPPY
    2. Pro Democracy

    Group 1 always use propaganda and blind faith, without much logic or warped logic, they cannot accept logic.

    Group 2 always try to reason and show facts.

    Nah, you got it wrong. It is Group 2 that always use propaganda and blind faith, without much logic or warped logic, they cannot accept logic.

    Group 1 always try to reason and show facts.

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  • knn:

    If Ferrari claimed that its car could hit 100mph in 3 sec and had a video record of it. And no one could disprove it, then the claim could be believeable.

    50 years later, Ferrari said they could not make a car to hit 100mph in 3 sec. The simplest thing to do is to remake the same car from the blueprint to repeat the same act. This is mechanical, same engine, same car, same condition, must be able to repeat same act.

    With today’s technology and material, Ferrari should easily do it or better the old record.

    If Ferrari still could not do it, it is proof that they did not do it 50 years ago. Ferrari just proved they were lying in the past.

    Simple easy logic. Only blind believers would still claim Ferrari had done it.

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  • SS:

    Folks, there is true inflation based on demand pull/push, too much money or too much easy credit. Also, because sometimes normal cycles in costs or seasons. Inflation due to world disruption is not really inflation at all. Just financial and cost dislocation and to treat it with traditional policy (fiscal or monetary) like raising FED rates is not going to do much more than increase costs and thus perceived inflation.

    The trade war with China is a total failure, but Biden administration keeps doubling down with the same failed strategy. China intentionally has cut off vital exports to US, calling it production slowdowns due to Covid. New car, computer and appliance manufacturing in the US is in a state of crisis right now due to a lack of parts from China.

    Interestingly not hearing anything regarding the administrations support for the urgent creation of manufacturing in the US of critical parts and medicines from China. Where is a policy for this? Nowhere. Why?

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  • Singaporean R Free Rider:

    BK: The framing of the Ukraine-Russia war is incomplete without the background of the breakup of the Soviet Union.

    Russia also had a war with Georgia in 2008, on the same premise of protecting Russian speaking populations. Then they took Crimea.

    And if you are a small country in Europe near Russia, what will be the legitimate course of action? Of course you try to join Nato.

    Turkiye (formally Turkey) a Nato member, never condemned Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, it initially objected to Sweden and Finland joining Nato, then did a deal and lifted the objection.
    ..
    ..

    Well said bro. I agreed with your entire post. Good analysis.

    Do post an update on your volunteer effort to help workers to shame all that only talk cawk sing song.

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  • Singaporean R Free Rider:

    Real democracy: Nah, you got it wrong. It is Group 2 that always use propaganda and blind faith, without much logic or warped logic, they cannot accept logic.

    Group 1 always try to reason and show facts.

    Well said bro. We PAP had presented many facts but some people are just blind.

    These people either blindly believe in Americunt/Chinacunt.
    Do not choose any side for you will be betrayed just like them below.

    Americunt history of betrayal

    1) Form & Abandon Alliances As Per Convenience
    video at https://shorturl.at/mHU24

    2) US betrayed Ukraine. ’22.07.04【觀點│亮點交鋒】烏克蘭被出賣對台灣啟示
    video at https://bit.ly/3nFIjqC

    Chinacunt history of betrayal …it is just beginning…Akang Datang

    1) Sri Lankan Crisis between Chinese Debt-trap and Strategic-trap
    https://isdp.eu/sri-lankan-crisis-between-debt-trap-and-strategic-trap-the-chinese-stake/

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  • PAP mandate strong:

    Well if it facts or sarcasm u people want, so be it.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W82om-FDmW4
    打臉中國“芯片對抗”計畫, 以為打下台灣, 就能自造芯片? 為何台灣能造芯片, 中國卻不行的原因 !

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yJKbquy0DlA
    倪匡笑談共產黨

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    BK:
    The framing of the Ukraine-Russia war is incomplete without the background of the breakup of the Soviet Union.

    Russia also had a war with Georgia in 2008, on the same premise of protecting Russian speaking populations. Then they took Crimea…..

    Good effort to de-escalate all the screaming and mud-slinging. Again, agree this Ukraine war has to be traced back to the fall of the Soviet Bloc. However, I think probably the First Chechen war first showed Putin’s obsession of restoring the Great Soviet ex-Empire, and that the Russian army is junk. If Putin still thinking about “strategic space”, then might as well invade Poland & the eastern part of Germany too – back to the Cold War borders.

    Anyway, again global issues are not really my forte. Unfortunately TRE doesn’t seems the place to be having deep (long) analysis – either locally of globally, just lots of screaming on self-interest issues or trolls diverting attention.

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  • Sheep or ~sheep:

    There are many combinations.

    1. Sheep, pappy sheep and western sheep. Swallow SPH and western propaganda for food.
    2. Half sheep. Pappy sheep but not western sheep, .e.g. Free Rider
    3. Pro real democracy. Not the sheep that follow fake democracy. Real Americans consider US to be not a democracy. Those HK “pro-democracy” are sheep that follow fake democracy.
    4. Pro truth.

    idontbelieveinccpbs:
    @Singaporeans are free riders using a lot of propaganda

    Basically 2 groups of writers here:

    1. Pro autocracy China/Russia and PAPPY
    2. Pro Democracy

    Group 1 always use propaganda and blind faith, without much logic or warped logic, they cannot accept logic.

    Group 2 always try to reason and show facts.

    So why dont group 1 move to China, at least prove to Group 2 that they really mean what they say?

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Real democracy: Nah, you got it wrong. It is Group 2 that always use propaganda and blind faith, without much logic or warped logic, they cannot accept logic.

    Group 1 always try to reason and show facts.

    Group 1 reasons and facts: Cotton is from sheep, mee siam mai hum, Terrex is a “civilian vehicle”, pig given long runway can fly, generals can manage rail/logistic operations, SG was a tiny fishing village when pap took over, 160th media is “most trusted”, etc….

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  • SS:

    If you want to understand the Ukraine/Russia situation, particularly the nuclear aspect, this article is a must read,”Ukraine & Nukes”,
    https://consortiumnews.com/2022/03/03/ukraine-nukes/

    Zelensky’s speech at Munich made it clear that Ukraine was moving to repudiate the Budapest Memorandum and essentially stated that Ukraine must be made a member of NATO, otherwise it would acquire nuclear weapons. So, when the leader of Ukraine essentially threatens to obtain nuclear weapons, this is most certainly considered to be an existential threat to Russia. That is why Putin focused on this during his speech preceding the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

    If you want to stop an armed invasion of your or someone else’s country, you have to meet force with force. A question no reporter dares ask of Blinken or Biden: If doing the same thing for years, even decades – sanctions – has done little to nothing, why will the result be different with more of the same thing, by whatever name that same thing is given this time (super sanctions, mega sanctions, etc.) Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is, as the saying goes, a definition of lunacy. That’s hard reality.

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  • Singaporeans R Free Riders:

    SS: If you want to understand the Ukraine/Russia situation, particularly the nuclear aspect, this article is a must read,”Ukraine & Nukes”,
    https://consortiumnews.com/2022/03/03/ukraine-nukes/

    Zelensky’s speech at Munich made it clear that Ukraine was moving to repudiate the Budapest Memorandum and essentially stated that Ukraine must be made a member of NATO, otherwise it would acquire nuclear weapons. So, when the leader of Ukraine essentially threatens to obtain nuclear weapons, this is most certainly considered to be an existential threat to Russia. That is why Putin focused on this during his speech preceding the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
    ..
    ..

    Good factual information…clap..clap

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  • BK:

    Yo bro.

    Actually in Putin’s broadcast to Russia on the invasion, he didnt mention nuclear arms. He mentioned Nato and the essence of the breakdown of the Minsk agreement.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/2/24/putins-speech-declaring-war-on-ukraine-translated-excerpts

    The Munich speech was on 19 Feb. The invasion of Ukraine was on 24 Feb. It would be incredible that the Munich speech was the catalyst for the war. War preparations must have taken months at least.

    The breakdown of the Minsk agreements contributed to the fraying of the Budapest Memorandum.

    Minsk agreements (2014/15) guaranteed the integrity of Ukraine while giving some parts of Russian speaking regions self governance.

    Budapest Memorandum (1994) guaranteed security of Ukraine in exchange for giving up nuclear arms placed there by the Soviet Union.

    1. The taking of Crimea meant that Russia cannot be trusted. And Russia support for the breakaway regions meant the Minsk agreements were violated. And the integrity of Ukraine threatened.

    2. The threat of breaking Ukraine territory meant that the Budapest Memorandum was broken. Therefore, Ukraine has the right to nuclear arms since the Budapest Memorandum was violated.

    Therefore, the legimtimacy of Ukraine going nuclear was the forfeiture of Russia not respecting the Budapest Memorandum, without even Nato in the picture.

    As for Nazi-Ukraine, there is a huge gap of understanding what it means.

    During WW2, liked Indians supporting Japan to fight for independence against Great Britain, many Ukrainians fought with Germany against Russia for independence.

    Of course Russia will label such Ukrainians as Nazis. BUT…

    “As we will see, the Nazis active in Ukraine in 2022 are not Ukrainians who were involved with German Nazism during World War II. With rare exceptions, the latter are all dead. Modern neo-Nazism has largely different roots. However, to assess Russian claims of “Nazism in Ukraine” we should start from the start, i.e. from Ukrainian nationalism and World War II, which in fact first leads us to World War I…”

    https://bitterwinter.org/nazism-in-ukraine-separating-facts-from-fiction/

    The above article gives a better picture.

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  • PAP mandate strong:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2021/4/16/ukraine-may-seek-nuclear-weapons-if-left-out-of-nato-diplomat

    After crimea taken by russia in march 2014, its norm if Ukraine seek nuclear to defend itself against Russia. China go nuclear India also go nuclear. In the end, only some minor conflicts at the border.

    Remember Mao’s reign , russia and china relationship went south. 珍寶島 incident. Russia wanted to drop a nuke on China. Even called USA for opinion.

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  • Curious:

    Really? Can give some links or not?

    idontbelieveinccpbs: Now China go to the extreme extent and bans casual words like “money钱”, people cannot type 钱 on social media, you have to use rice instead aka “我今天赚了多少米”. Money钱 is now a dirty word on China Social Media. This is your China model and if you love it, migrate there.

    Tech: I also just curious, which idiot told “idontbelieveinccpbs” that?

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  • theforgottongeneration:

    Why use the Minsk Agreements as argument for what is happening in Ukraine? Russia annexation of Crimea (in early 2014) already showed that Putin is out grabbing territory. The Minsk Agreements (in later 2014 onwards) only told Putin that negotiations can buy him time and maybe some concessions to further land gains – that Ukraine and the West is AFRAID of war. Surrendering the Crimea to him only strengthen his resolve to remake the ex-Soviet empire.

    Interestingly, can quote Zelensky’s Munich speech in 2022 but cannot quote Munich Agreement 1938 which showed the world how dangerous it is to give in to dictators hoping to rein in their ambitions. It never works!

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  • History, your version:

    You love history? Go read up how US planned and almost atomic bomb out USSR immediately after WWII. It’s on the web somewhere. The world was saved from the mad Americans.

    PAP mandate strong:
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2021/4/16/ukraine-may-seek-nuclear-weapons-if-left-out-of-nato-diplomat

    After crimea taken by russia in march 2014, its norm if Ukraine seek nuclear to defend itself against Russia. China go nuclear India also go nuclear. In the end, only some minor conflicts at the border.

    Remember Mao’s reign , russia and china relationship went south. 珍寶島 incident. Russia wanted to drop a nuke on China. Even called USA for opinion.

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  • MarBowling:

    SS:
    July 8, 2022 at 7:33 pm (Quote)
    If you want to understand the Ukraine/Russia situation, particularly the nuclear aspect, this article is a must read,”Ukraine & Nukes”,
    https://consortiumnews.com/2022/03/03/ukraine-nukes/

    Zelensky’s speech at Munich made it clear that Ukraine was moving to repudiate the Budapest Memorandum and essentially stated that Ukraine must be made a member of NATO, otherwise it would acquire nuclear weapons. So, when the leader of Ukraine essentially threatens to obtain nuclear weapons, this is most certainly considered to be an existential threat to Russia. That is why Putin focused on this during his speech preceding the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

    If you want to stop an armed invasion of your or someone else’s country, you have to meet force with force. A question no reporter dares ask of Blinken or Biden: If doing the same thing for years, even decades – sanctions – has done little to nothing, why will the result be different with more of the same thing, by whatever name that same thing is given this time (super sanctions, mega sanctions, etc.) Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is, as the saying goes, a definition of lunacy. That’s hard reality.

    Response: Mother of All Hard Truths! Hat off and salute Put-In. Sleepy Joe and his pet poodle Monica Zelenskyy can go fly kite and mate with Black Widow Spider, period!

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  • PAP mandate strong:

    Hey man. You were the one who wrote ” The world was saved from the mad Americans. ” . I never !
    Why not 1995 Russia almost fire nuke on USA ? What about Cuban missiles crisis ?

    I remember BK ever comment ( cant remember exactly the words he wrote ) that eventually many countries will be force to have nuclear e.g. SK , japan , even Taiwan or Ausralia….etc. Something like that.

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  • BK:

    PAP mandate strong:
    Hey man. You were the one who wrote ” The world was saved from the mad Americans. ” . I never !
    Why not 1995 Russia almost fire nuke on USA ? What about Cuban missiles crisis ?

    I remember BK ever comment ( cant remember exactly the words he wrote ) that eventually many countries will be force to have nuclear e.g. SK , japan , even Taiwan or Ausralia….etc. Something like that.

    I think I said it in the context of US nuclear umbrella. As a way to prevent nuclear proliferation, a nuclear attack on Japan and South Korea will be treated as an attack on US.

    US navy and nuclear umbrella allowed Asia by and large not to get involved in arms race, a peace dividend we had enjoyed minus the Korea and Vietnam wars.

    China in SSC changed the security ecosystem. The military spending across the region had gone up. And the other part is that US no longer wants to bear the full burden of securing the region.

    If US pulls out totally, which is what China wants, then it is conceivable that Japan and South Korea will go nuclear.

    Australia has already started to build their nuclear subs. Perhaps they know something we dont.

    China hawks may get their wish. But in fact, it will be a more unstable region.

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  • SS:

    Thank you, bro
    After the Chernobyl disaster, the Ukrainians are not interested in making nuclear fuel — which they already purchases from the U.S. But with plenty of plutonium, which is commonly used to make nuclear weapons; Ukraine held more than 50 tons of plutonium in its spent fuel assemblies stored at its many nuclear power plants (probably considerably more today, as the reactors have continued to run and produce spent fuel). Once plutonium is reprocessed/separated from spent nuclear fuel, it becomes weapons usable. Likely, the high priority for Putin is to take all Ukrainian plutonium. Very sensible!

    The agreement not in effect and already broken:
    Poroshenko has already announced that he will not talk to the leaders of the Donbass and Luhansk. Dimitry Yarosh, Right Sektor, had declared he will keep fighting and does not recognize Minsk II. Ukrainian army gave him 17 Battalions of troops for his Right Sektor milita paid for by Kolomoisky. Pavlo Klimkin, Ukraine Foreign Ministers, says the amnesty does not apply to the leaders of Donbass and Luhask, as Kiev had passed a law in September 2014 that no amnesty would apply to Zakharchenko or Plotnisky thus that part of Minsk is invalid.

    One of the excuses given by people like Lysenako and Klimkin is that Poroshenko did NOT sign any document so they can ignore what the rebel leaders and the OSCE and Kuchma signed. Ukraine’s Right Sector leader Dmitry Yarosh said his radical movement rejects the Minsk peace deal and that their paramilitary units in eastern Ukraine will continue “active fighting” according to their “own plans. This is the view from Kiev. I know every reader spits on Right Sector – but there is this interesting story in it which I believe to be TRUE, “http://rt.com/news/232183-ukraine-yarosh-war-minsk/

    In case you don’t know, the Kiev regime are attacking and killing civilians. Their neo-Nazi brigades are ruthless. But no one talks about pressuring them in backing off and respecting any agreement whatsoever. If one believe that the Ukrainian separatists are merely proxies for Russia, than one must admit that Poroshenko’s government is a proxy for the EU and NATO.

    By ignoring democratic elections and driving the politically divided country into armed camps, they have lost Crimea and will eventually see an Eastern Ukraine with greater autonomy. For better or for worse, the battle is over and the Ukrainians have no one to blame but themselves. When Russian invaded and annexed Crimea, Ukraine was so desperate for peace that it walked away without firing a shot. Russia responded by invading Donetsk and Luhansk.

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  • Western Sheep:

    It’s proven, once again, that commenters make up their own fake news. Then they proudly share their “expert fact-based logical” opinion.

    Curious: Really? Can give some links or not?

    idontbelieveinccpbs: Now China go to the extreme extent and bans casual words like “money钱”, people cannot type 钱 on social media, you have to use rice instead aka “我今天赚了多少米”. Money钱 is now a dirty word on China Social Media. This is your China model and if you love it, migrate there.

    Tech: I also just curious, which idiot told “idontbelieveinccpbs” that?

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  • BK:

    Morning Sjorne,

    Bro, to go abit further back. Ukraine was on the verge of signing an agreement with EU, process started in 2008.

    Obviously, the EU market will be more lucrative, of course, compared to the Russia-CIS market.

    In 2013 under pressure from Russia, the former President Yanukovych stalled the agreement. Thats when protest- civil unrest from Ukrainians started- Revolution dignity. This brought down Yanukovych, and after handing over power, he and his govt fled.

    In 2014, Russia took Crimea. And also in 2014, the Donbass war started.

    The timeline points to Russia interference.

    1. Russia does not want Ukraine to be closer to EU. Although all logic shows that with EU, Ukraine gets a better pathway for economic growth.

    2. Russia annexation of Crimea and the Donbas war started after its pro Russia
    President Yanukovych lost it in a democratic process.

    3. While atrocities were committed in the Donbas war, but Russia armed the separatists and supported them. It is ridiculous that the narrative was only neo Nazi Ukraine brutality when the Donbas war was started with Russia help.

    I think any other country would want better pathways for themselves. In this instance, it is clear Russia is treating Ukraine as its puppet.

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  • SS:

    Thank you, bro BK,

    Each party have own theory that will contribute Ukraine ultimately. Only history can tell after disputes settled which party would really be good for people, sadly ordinary case winner prevail among historians. Ukraine happened to occur repeatedly everywhere on this globe every time since human appeared in this world. Russian have to protect her vested interests and reputation, EU too protect the new interest there in forms of bank loan, politically motivated industrial investment there, intended cultural invasion under the name of democracy. Both party have legitimate rights there each. Ukraine would be divided naive, simple ones who insist Russia or EU, tend to be exploit from their boss as a proxy and ones maneuver for real Ukraine’s benefits. If this guess were some true elements in this mayhem, we can have a kind of hope there.

    Before Yanukovish, Ukraine had the corrupt Gas Princess and Yuschenko. Remember the Ukrainians got fed up with them and when elections rolled around they voted for Yankukovich. The west declared that the elections were mostly free and fair.

    Mr. Yanukovych wins an election and is the legal President but his opponents using illegal, anti-democratic violence (Revolution Of Dignity) to try to overthrow him? Why couldn’t the demonstrators wait for the next election to vote him out of office and elect a President that would move Ukraine in the direction they desire?

    Ultimate destination depends on people, recent world people’s consensus shows subtle changing trends from globalization or expansion to shrink, concentrate domestic(people tired intervention, the other counties conflict, est), stay where we are now attitude. It is hope for Ukraine, the possibility to reach a compromise because both big powers cannot ignore own people’s consensus utterly.

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  • BK:

    Thank you Sir. Enjoyed the repartee. Have a good one bro (:

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  • SS:

    Very engaging and profound thoughts from you. Thanks!

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  • The world:

    The world is getting worse…not better.
    Are we in the last days ?
    Seem so much evil and suffering everywhere…

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  • Western Sheep:

    Take some hope. Not all suffering. Some western sheep blah together and enjoy themselves. LOL.

    The world:
    The world is getting worse…not better.
    Are we in the last days ?
    Seem so much evil and suffering everywhere…

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