Unfair treatment during NS needs to change

The difference in treatment of NSFs has caused serious social divide between the haves and haves-not, or in this case, stay-in and stay-out. I have used a pseudonym for my friend’s son to protect his identity but I am sure his story will sound familiar to many of us.

A colleague of mine was very worried for his son, as his son is a 2nd gen PR who is the first in his family to serve NS. His son J, was assigned to a combat unit after BMT, despite coming from a polytechnic. He was shocked as he thought it will be a better use of his son’s time to serve in an office environment, so he can learn some skills that will be better for his career. After all, his son had graduated with a business diploma and will be equipped to handle the camp’s finances and administrative work.

J could not adapt to the strict regimentation expected of him and requested to be post out to a stay-out camp but his request was not entertained. On weekends, he was even required to do guard duties while the security troopers could stay-out everyday and had their weekends free. J’s warrant officers accused J of trying to “keng” when J claimed he needed to stay out, and accused him of being a liar when he expressed his desire to be a clerk as it was a better use of his skills. As J was unable to fulfill his desire to be a clerk, he subsequently dropped out of the riflemen course and failed the assessments required. However, his warrant officers continued to keep him in the unit and refused to let him book out after 5 everyday, effectively making him stay in. His frustrations was exacerbated by the fact that he was given extra duties for trying to “keng” and dropping out of course, even after he repeatedly expressed his lack of interest in being trained as a rifleman. Meanwhile, he says many clerks and storemen in his unit have little interest in their jobs and skive all day before booking out.

I am sure many Singaporeans are used to this but this system has got to change. Why is SAF so inflexible with its soldiers? Shouldn’t poly grads be prioritised for administrative roles, and let them serve as aides and clerks, instead of using them as riflemen? Poly graduates are already trained in project work, business administrative skills and communication skills. They should be used as aides to generals, and serve their country in a different capacity more befitting of their qualifications. This will also help their career as it shows they have relevant work experience, rather than a simple riflemen role. Physically demanding roles such as riflemen vocations should be given to other soldiers who are not interested in administrative role instead.

Overall, the unfair treatment needs to stop. J should have an option to choose his vocation so he will be interested in the work he is doing. There is no point in letting uninterested soldiers be trained for a role they feel is useless.

GdDragon

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28 Responses to “Unfair treatment during NS needs to change”

  • I'M Halimah also Jiak Liao bee:

    Too bad you are not born Patrick Tan, otherwise, you could have the luxury to choose whichever vocation you like, and moreover can also f\deder for 7 years.
    Some people are just born lucky to have a PAP VVIP as a father who as Defence Minister, can chose to do this the LEEgal corrupted way.

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  • patriot of TUMASIK:

    Too BAD if you are NOT a White Horse sired by a Stallion that sire at WORSE a GREY!!!…but occasionally sired FREAKS!!!

    A Donkey or Mule can turn out to be a BETTER work animal and does NOT need spurs on their HIDES…only Horses do when they are racing or urged on owing to their Pedigree!!!

    Donkey & Mule are NATRALs… Pedigrees??? you decide especially those around you

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  • No Keng:

    Boy, you should be outside fighting for your lunch boxes. While you in the Army, don’t tell me the CECA FTs protect them for you.

    Furthermore Diploma Cert vs CECA degrees holders from India, how to protect?

    Quickly serve, Quickly finish la.

    But I think, the whole army thing should be abolished for Professional Full Time Army paid by the government as they reap benefits from the CECA agreement.

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  • why become citizen?:

    without fail we shake our heads when we hear of new 70% sheep becoming citizens. they think there is gold in the pink passport when all they get is pap BS and over priced HDB rental units and the incessant lies by pap about car lite and cannot eat degree.

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  • dolphin81:

    Allow me to explain J’s likely situation in the wider context based on what has been written:

    J was enlisted with a combat vocation medical grading.

    After BMT he was posted to a combat infantry unit as a rifleman (the modern version of a footsoldier)

    Somewhere along the way, he was sort of medically downgraded.There is no way he can “drop out” of a combat vocation course for enlisted personnel (those from PTE to CPL ranks) for non-medical reasons

    His medical downgrading is probably only temporary.Therefore he is still inside the a combat company within the unit battalion. In simple terms, he is a temporary clerk or storeman.Within the company, he is still subjected to the regimentation of the combat company similar to that of a rifleman.

    The regimentation includes having to
    -) perform night time guard duty which is shared by the companies for the whole battaltion
    -) stay in, with booking out considered a privilege

    The warrant officers (most likely the company sergeant-major) have no intention of letting go of J. These superiors are simply waiting for the opportunity to put J back into a combat vocation witin the company.

    As for security out-troopers, they are out-troopers by official vocation and under the HQ company of the battalion. They are not under the component combat company. From my understanding, some of these out-troopers may be rotated to other camps depending on the situation.

    Menawhile the skivving clerks and storemen described here may be those under HQ company, not under the component combat companies.HQ COY is usually known for lesser regimentation and more “switched off”.

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  • Darth Vader:

    Dear GdDragon,

    Can you please tell your son this? NO ONE OWES HIM A G*******D LIVING! BY DEFAULT, if an NS man is found to be combat fit, he gets assigned to a combat unit! If he’s such a namby-pamby spoiled brat that he wants a cushy office job doing financial administration, then he should BLOODY SIGN ON as a regular, specifically for such a post!!!!

    Hey, if he doesn’t get assigned to the infantry than someone else will be! WHAT is so special about him that he should NOT be assigned to an infantry unit while others are?! And he DELIBERATELY failed his infantry training you say? He should be sent to detention for ot! And he still dares demand to stay out? He wants to stay out, then he should sign on for a non-combat vocation, and he should wake up from his dreamland that just because he has a poly diploma he’s entitled to special treatment!

    You know what, if his daddy hates the treatment his sin is getting in NS then the whole damned worthless family should just leave Singapore and return to their own country so that none of them need to serve! AFTER the spoiled little prince goes ORD of course! And it would be good riddance to absolute GARBAGE to see them gone!!!!

    Bloody ingrates, after getting job opportunities here they can’t get back home don’t even want to give back to the country!!!!

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  • Darth Vader:

    Your friend’s son I mean

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  • SinkieSoldier:

    dolphin81:
    Allow me to explain J’s likely situation in the wider context based on what has been written:

    J was enlisted with a combat vocation medical grading.

    After BMT he was posted to a combat infantry unit as a rifleman (the modern version of a footsoldier)

    Somewhere along the way, he was sort of medically downgraded.There is no way he can “drop out” of a combat vocation course for enlisted personnel (those from PTE to CPL ranks) for non-medical reasons

    His medical downgrading is probably only temporary.Therefore he is still inside the a combat company within the unit battalion. In simple terms, he is a temporary clerk or storeman.Within the company, he is still subjected to the regimentation of the combat company similar to that of a rifleman.

    The regimentation includes having to
    -) perform night time guard duty which is shared by the companies for the whole battaltion
    -) stay in, with booking out considered a privilege

    The warrant officers (most likely the company sergeant-major) have no intention of letting go of J. These superiors are simply waiting for the opportunity to put J back into a combat vocation witin the company.

    As for security out-troopers, they are out-troopers by official vocation and under the HQ company of the battalion. They are not under the component combat company. From my understanding, some of these out-troopers may be rotated to other camps depending on the situation.

    Menawhile the skivving clerks and storemen described here may be those under HQ company, not under the component combat companies.HQ COY is usually known for lesser regimentation and more “switched off”.

    Hence it is unfair right? Why do some enjoy going home while others don’t? Especially if they get the same allowance, and security troopers get to go home Everyday while riflemen stay in

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  • laugh die foreigner in Sg:

    No Keng:
    Boy, you should be outside fighting for your lunch boxes. While you in the Army, don’t tell me the CECA FTs protect them for you.

    Furthermore Diploma Cert vs CECA degrees holders from India, how to protect?

    Quickly serve, Quickly finish la.

    But I think, the whole army thing should be abolished for Professional Full Time Army paid by the government as they reap benefits from the CECA agreement.

    same same. boy he should be fighting outside for his lunch boxes and those of his own son and daughter. instead this guy is fighting for the some foreigner’s son to chow keng his ns vocation.

    wait for the day his son get tekan jialat jialat upside down left right center by ceca foreigners who becomes the bosses of his son in the workplace.

    sinkies kana makan what kongtau from ah loong until become blur king in his own country. what a laugh die foreigner scenario lah!

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  • Hank:

    What an absurd complaint! There are tens of thousands of guys doing what this J has to do. Moreover he is a second generation PR. Business diploma wanna get excused, are you mad? There are probably tens of thousands of NS men with better qualifications. All just sit in the office? Then who do the fighting if there is a crisis?

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  • PAP.GUARANTEE.WIN.GE2019/20:

    Hello GdDragon,
    You think army is a playground that let you try this job and try that job until you happy then you stay in that job.

    If everyone want it their way, army will be in chaos like this one.
    http://news.tvb.com/local/5d4805a9e6038361613c4480/%E8%8D%83%E7%81%A3%E6%9C%89%E7%A4%BA%E5%A8%81%E8%80%85%E5%8C%85%E5%9C%8D%E5%8F%8A%E7%A0%B4%E5%A3%9E%E8%AD%A6%E8%BB%8A-%E6%B2%99%E7%94%B0%E6%9C%89%E5%8F%97%E9%98%BB%E5%8F%B8%E6%A9%9F%E6%8C%81%E6%96%A7%E9%A0%AD%E6%8C%87%E5%9A%87

    Remember, PM Lee had made it clear that Singapore belong to everyone.
    NS or no NS.

    Just tell J to shut up and serve NS.

    It is an honor to serve NS, so said Josephine Teo.

    PAP.GUARANTEE.WIN.GE2019/20

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  • Pui Pui:

    I did not see any unfair treatment, we never get any vocation of your choice, we have diploma holder with driver vocation·. I sense u want special treatment because you are holding PR status. The father of this kid count himself lucky as he did not have to serve any national service being the first PR status. I would propose that even the first PR generation have to sever some form of yearly in camp training, so that we are all the same playing field as the local.

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  • opposition dude:

    The army will NEVER let poly graduates all be in admin roles, it would be a waste of manpower. After all, how many clerks do you need from a whole year’s batch of poly graduates?

    And if most poly graduates wanted to be in admin roles then who is going to be a soldier? You think there are enough ITE graduates and all those who dropped out of school ah? And please don’t forget hor, all these army boys are just cheap labour for PAP. Graduating with a diploma means you should be paid what you are worth, not a mere few hundred dollars under the basis of protecting the nation.

    What the government should do is to have all new citizens serve mandatory reservist, why the hell are they given the option to serve in the wayang SAFVC which they can quit after giving notice? Doesn’t PAP love saying that national defence is very important? Why draw such a line between true blues and converted citzens?

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  • Obviously Know Not:

    The author is either dreaming in his own world or has never done any NS.
    Slaves and conscripts have no rights in the army, let alone choosing your own vocation or negotiate your own ‘ns careerpath’ or indulge in better use of slaves debate.

    Having known the working of the army, the author will not bother to write such laughable article. Conscripts are vital free resources to train paper generals and prove their worths. Any change to current slavery system would necessarily mean voting in a new government.

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  • DavidNeo&IreneVanessa:Bastards:

    Many also frigtened of physical training and want to do si nang (cushy) work like clerk. Can. Just declare 302. 302 means ah boy wants to be ah girl and go for gender re assignment surgery. But I know many sissies also went through combat as they failed to be down graded. I think only those dress and act like girls – the serious cases have a shot at clerk dom.

    I know someone declare himself insane. But very hard one lah. It’s almost impossible yo change vocation unless the soldier is unable to stand up and walk.

    The next best thing is storeman. Depends on camp. Some stay in and some stay out.My friend spent his time fcuking the male 2nd lieutenent in the stay in store.

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  • Flabbergasted:

    If everyone can become clerk when he wants to, how then it is fair for us who have children in the commandos, guards and divers?

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  • What the World:

    Precisely, you protect them inside, no booking out, they quietly eat your lunches away…. no one protect…. no one care LOL … isn’t it silly.. what the world? this influx don’t eat, next influxes certainly will…. after your ROD, you fight with “N” times of influxes….. LOL but no joking, problem is real. no one cares…

    And then worse…. you don’t get to vote until 21….. hahahahahaha

    No Keng:
    Boy, you should be outside fighting for your lunch boxes. While you in the Army, don’t tell me the CECA FTs protect them for you.

    Furthermore Diploma Cert vs CECA degrees holders from India, how to protect?

    Quickly serve, Quickly finish la.

    But I think, the whole army thing should be abolished for Professional Full Time Army paid by the government as they reap benefits from the CECA agreement.

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  • pap S$m clan of lying liars:

    dolphin81:
    Allow me to explain J’s likely situation in the wider context based on what has been written:

    J was enlisted with a combat vocation medical grading.

    After BMT he was posted to a combat infantry unit as a rifleman (the modern version of a footsoldier)

    Somewhere along the way, he was sort of medically downgraded.There is no way he can “drop out” of a combat vocation course for enlisted personnel (those from PTE to CPL ranks) for non-medical reasons

    His medical downgrading is probably only temporary.Therefore he is still inside the a combat company within the unit battalion. In simple terms, he is a temporary clerk or storeman.Within the company, he is still subjected to the regimentation of the combat company similar to that of a rifleman.

    The regimentation includes having to
    -) perform night time guard duty which is shared by the companies for the whole battaltion
    -) stay in, with booking out considered a privilege

    The warrant officers (most likely the company sergeant-major) have no intention of letting go of J. These superiors are simply waiting for the opportunity to put J back into a combat vocation witin the company.

    As for security out-troopers, they are out-troopers by official vocation and under the HQ company of the battalion. They are not under the component combat company. From my understanding, some of these out-troopers may be rotated to other camps depending on the situation.

    Menawhile the skivving clerks and storemen described here may be those under HQ company, not under the component combat companies.HQ COY is usually known for lesser regimentation and more “switched off”.

    if not making S$m like pap folks, if not maserati or live in bungalow like pap folks, but only in over priced HDB and squeeze in mrt bus to get to camp, who is J defending and why should he defend?

    sure. he had a choice before becoming New Citizen. but if he can he should try his best to revert back to old citizenship. because this cheap soldiering ain’t going to end after ROD. There is this NSR thereafter.

    We tell J all the wasted days and nights, whether NSF or NSR, ain’t worth the pink IC.

    so those parents who become New Citizen and junior suffers, who is kidding who? These parents are pure and simple as stupid as local born 70% sheep.

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  • Why?:

    Give almost $1million tax payers dollars a day to foreign students + CECA indian degrees holders and then while you inside army with only Diploma Certificate, not only lunch boxes insecure, but others having better lifestyles and big car, high positions, you no choice have to sacrifice gf for them take care for you. You ask Why!?

    Better demand parents to make the Right Choice for you at the BOX.

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  • The Zen of SIAM.:

    Just take it as nightmares and ROD quickly la!.

    The practice is “You don’t care, I don’t care”, so be safe while in the Army. Remember if you end up in the box testing the cold ambient temperature, your parents cry also can’t do anything.

    LOBO and SIAM.

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  • J, why?:

    J, why you become 2nd-gen PR? It is a very stupid decision. Those who avoided that PR can stay on in Singapore without suffering NS and reservist.

    J, why you want to stay on in Singapore? There are many years of suffering as a reservist. More torture in camps. More physical tests and torture outside camp.

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  • Harder Truths:

    So GdDragon wants preferred status for FT in NS.
    To choose where they want to go and what they should do.
    Also to be given higher ranks as befits their status.

    It may happen – it is true everywhere else in $G the FT rule the locals. Why allow NS to break that trend?

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  • NS have its merits:

    Wah lan a …

    Like that also want to complain ?
    No wonder 2 young men against 1 uncle also cannot win.

    This type of stds, still want to suggest to let them vote at 18 ?

    What he expect? Holiday camp is it?
    How about go awol or go viral and how many support him or feck him?

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  • Your Father's Army ?:

    First Question why want to be PR in Singapore ? Is it to enjoy the benefits ?

    Second Question. You think its your father’s Army ? Can Do what you like ?

    Your friend son should do whatever the rest do, citizen or PR. Polytechnic qualification big deal is it ? If all polytechnic students become clerks, is their PR fathers willing to take over the combat role ?

    In fact we should send back all the farking foreigners back home. KNNBCCB.

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  • Dr. Chan:

    My son is Medical Officer (Captain) in US Army. If I want him to obtain Singapore PR must he be Recruit in NS SAF?

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  • Check your own Brain:

    Just check your own brains. Are you ready against the whites?

    This could jolly well be written by MIWs to denounce mentality of the 18 years old as not fit for voting.

    Those who fallen into it, you should just slap yourself.

    When anyone tells you “I sell this for a friend” or “My friend ask”…… you give 100% discount first regardless authenticity.

    Who with such mentality will write like this you tell me. Those PRs, they will be smarter than you how to “Tripod” the MIWs.

    Except some of the replies which clearly had shown their wisdom, Sinkies with such fallen mentality, Singaland sure lose.!

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  • speckofdust:

    Thanks for sharing. The NS system in Singapore is horrible. Conscripts suffer. Looks like J has tasted the bitterness of what Singaporean males go through. Besides full-time national service, there’s also the operationally ready national service call-ups which keep disrupting the lives of NSmen. NS has not helped me but caused me to sacrifice my youth and damaged my life. Voters ought to vote wisely in the next general elections. Our actions ought to be consistent with what we want. Deployment depends on PES and luck. If sons in Singapore can down PES, it is best to do so before enlistment.

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  • Eric:

    Aiyah, not happy then vote for PSP in coming Election!!

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